Taycan vs Telsa M3P thoughts?

[Hanny]

Both cars run on electricity. That's the only thing they have in common. Why are people comparing them?

My counter to that is ‘why not?’ - it’s a forum that people use to ask questions, gleam knowledge and to enjoy. Think it is better to have forum that is open for any posts rather than some other forums that can be toxic to those who have opinion/view with another makes…..at the end of the day they are just cars…..

 

[RingoDingo]

I think comparing them is a natural thing, they are the two main high performance EV’s available on the UK Market. In a few months time we will see the same comparisons with the EV6 GT when they start delivering.

I agree they are very different cars but you only have to look at the number of people going from an M3P to a Taycan on this forum to see that it is a stepping stone to a Taycan so both cars must appeal to a similar group.

This is potentially most relevant among the first time Porsche buyers who are simply looking for a step up in EV ownership after living with a Tesla, this is definitely the camp I am in.

Totally agree. I bought an M3P because I am a "car enthusiast" and I made the decision that for my limited personal transportation needs and because personally I wanted to encourage the adoption of electric vehicles (for both environmental and political reasons), I would forgo the vroom vrooms and get the best performing EV available, which was at the time the Tesla Model 3 Performance. When I discovered the Taycan and saw they made a model in my price range (and once I got past the psychological hurdles of spending six figures on a car), I was all a-go. I think the M3P is a great first step for people considering EV adoption - it just does everything pretty well, and I've encouraged others to buy them, and they've been happy with them. It just wasn't for me.

I suspect I'll be in the market for an electric 718 GTS or the like at some point as well, with the hope that it further bridges the gap between what car enthusiasts want and EVs can deliver.

 

[TDinDC]

hmmmm. I was one of the first to receive the Tesla Model X, and I replaced the first one with a second one that I got rid of to get the Taycan (the second Tesla was worse than the first). Both were loaded up with all options and Ludicrous mode etc . . . So, they were fast. Very fast.

For the most part, I really liked my Teslas. Super-pissed that I paid 20K (10K per car) for self-driving based on empty promises and that build quality seemed to deteriorate. Also happy to no longer have anything to do with Tesla when I see Musk's antics. But the Tesla did some things really well.

When I read the way you framed your question, I have the impression that you care as much or more about the perception of quickness/speed rather than actual quickness/speed.

A lot of car manufacturers are now playing around with the consumer's desire for the perception of speed, which sells cars since few can actually use real speed on the public streets, and even fewer take their vehicles to the track. How do they do this? One way is by making throttle inputs extremely aggressive and touchy: you barely touch the throttle and the car seems to leap forward, which make your brain think "Wow, this is a monster . . . " But throttle mapping does not a fast car make.

While you can adjust throttle mapping on Teslas by going to "Chill" mode, the default throttle mapping for Teslas is very aggressive, which makes Teslas feel very fast. Teslas are not generally known for being smooth and composed.

Porsche, for the most part, focuses on quality of feedback to drivers and the ability for drivers to control their vehicle: in other words, Porsche tends to focus more than many manufacturers on actual speed rather than the perception of speed. For example, Porsches tend to have less aggressive throttle mapping, although it becomes more aggressive in certain settings (e.g., sport). After all, if you are driving fast and near the limit, aggressive throttle mapping is terrible, because it reduces the ability of the driver to hone throttle input more precisely, and it increases the chances that you might upset the car when transitioning to throttle.

As a result, Porsches sometimes don't feel as fast even if they are far faster. You can tell this if you block the speedometers/timers when you drive a Porsche, because many will be shocked at how fast they are driving or how quickly they reach speed because the car feels so utterly composed and no drama. Porsches are smooth, and, while the overused mantra "smooth is fast" is utter bullshit, you want your car to be smooth even if you are driving it like a banshee.

By contrast, the Teslas always felt hyper fast because they are not smooth. They are brutal, which feels very fast because you feel like you are near the edge of disaster. It reminded me of a homemade roller derby car with a Ferrari v12 bolted in: Fast and fun as hell but you are always worried about losing a body panel or door or something.

I prefer Porsche. In fairness, I'm not sure you would.

 

[Zcd1]

Any responses are much appreciated!

Go test drive a refreshed (2022+) Tesla Model S LR for additional perspective.

 

[Wilson]

I agree with the throttle mapping aspect to a certain degree. The only thing I found a little odd on the Taycan in our test drive was that in Normal mode the 'kick down' effect of the gearbox could make larger throttle inputs feel quite digital.

Speed wise I would say there is little in it between a 4S and an M3P on the open road, you have to keep a keen eye on the dial in both cars as they are capable of license losing speeds very quickly. Its only really from a total standstill that the M3P felt noticeably quicker which was always the M3 Long Range buyers comeback that from 40mph its basically identical performance so all you are paying for is the first 30 ft.

When driving at speed I definitely find the more ICE feeling throttle with minimal regeneration which is akin to engine braking more natural and confidence inspiring, there is much less of an accelerate then brake then accelerate feel when modulating the throttle.

I guess my main take away from the 4S drive was that its performance is much more rounded, it's not simply a straight line machine for the traffic light GP.

 

[Helixer]

I own an M3P. Taycan is to MP3 as Carrera is to Corvette.

 

[Valen]

I had a M3P for 3 years and had many Porsche before. I got a Taycan 4S with lots of options for about 8 months.

I really liked the M3P but it's not a Porsche. The M3P is great for what it is: a inexpensive performance sedan with a decent finish for the price.

For me it's closer to a BMW M3 than a Taycan.

Does it feels slower than the M3P? Yes but it's also because the suspension is so much better that it negates a part of the feeling.

Does the Taycan handles better? Yes, it's miles ahead of the M3P. It's not that the M3P is bad (it's decent for the price) but the Taycan behaves almost as my 911 4S did.

Which one is a better commuter? The taycan is a lot bigger than the M3P but with rear wheel steering it behaves like a much smaller car to the point that i prefer the Taycan as a daily.

Which one is better for roadtrip? Despites the marketing figures, the Taycan got a better real range on the highway, is a lot more confortable and is a stunner.

Which tech is better? Tesla one hands down. The rear view camera is embarassing even for a 20k car, the UI of the PCM is a mess, there's bugs everywhere and i have to carry a key.....

Which car is better?
- if you are short on budget almost nothing can beat a M3P
- if you are not, the Taycan is a great car.

PS: about the base one. I tried one but it lacks too much punch in front of the M3P. In real life everyday condition it's not really that you will use this power but when you pay 2 or 3 times the prices it hurts to feel 2 or 3 times slower

 

[Sandash]

I understand your hesitation in moving up to the GTS; it'll probably have a higher markup too. 4S is the minimum if you want an upgrade over the M3P. But with the 4S, there are some options that you'd want that'll already be standard on the GTS or cheaper. But 4S is definitely more engaging than the M3P, due to steering feel, chassis, suspension, and pedal feel. I think the GTS is the sweet spot for enthusiast driving.

 

[David Bennett]

How is the handling of the Taycan vs M3P - The M3P can be a bit jerky but certainly handles well - just not as confidence inspiring as the Alfa at high speeds.

Is the Taycan good enough to get rid of the Alfa and have both EVs? My wife is the primary driver of the Tesla and is not a car person at all so losing the Tesla is not an option. Or do I keep the Alfa and add the Taycan later - most likely around a year out if the Taycan won't fully scratch my itch?

Any responses are much appreciated!

I tried a QV when I was shopping for my last ICE but it was stock not modded like yours. I ended up with an M4CS which gave me more confidence at high speed. I traded that for my 4s with 21s and all the chassis options. The handling of the 4s is in another league to the M4, particularly the steering and body control. Of course I also get EV shove with the 4s and Porsche quality. I would not swap back. I hope that helps.

 

[Raphie]

Tesla is a sexless car, I’ve said it many times. You can pimp it all you like, but it’s remains to be an American car with Chinese antics. No matter how much carbon and Vossen you slap on it. Duckface with headlights which could as well be Toyota, Mazda, or Kia.

the interior is just as utilarian as a prison cell. No design wow, ugly Alixpress touchpad and lots of vinyl Vegan Leather.
everything feels cardboard. The only thing nice about the Plaid is speed. But even there it feels like the car is not build for that kind of power. Driving experience is everything. The Taycan is a different universe.

 

[17QV]

Wow, thank you ALL for these immensely detailed responses! I've got a lot to think about for sure.

 

[RGBArgee]

Agreed, tired of the taycan being compared to the M3P!

To the OP, you will be better off with minimum 4S, albeit a used one, you need dual motors. Have a look at this for comparison. If you can stretch it the GTS is the real winner!

Going GTS is a matter of preference... Personally I'm no fan of Alcantara.

 

[whitex]

@17QV , if switching from M3P to Taycan base, or even 4S, trade-in or at least stop driving the M3P a month ahead of the Taycan delivery (good change to drive the Alfa for a month). That way you won't feel like you're stepping down in power. I waited 20 months to get a Taycan Turbo CT, because my previous car was a Model S with Ludicrous. Every time I test drove the 4S, it felt like it was stalling on the highway when I floored the accelerator (I actually had no issue with off the line acceleration, but that maybe that's because I never floored in the MS either, since I never kept my car clean enough to not have to pick up all my belongings from the back seat if I ever launched it from a stand still). I say a month to be on a safe side, even a week might do the trick. My first MS was an MS60 which I thought was fast, but every time I got a faster loner, my car felt "broken" and "slow" for at a day or two. Long story short I upgraded to P85DL+ a couple of years later (when it came out). So, with the Taycan, I decided to just get what I want rather than do the upgrade after a year or two - it works out much cheaper that way.

Is the Taycan perfect, not at all - it has issues, but so do Teslas. Do I love the Taycan? Heck yea! Do I miss some things from the Tesla, of course. Biggest things I miss from the Tesla? Backup camera and more intuitive and more capable software, both in the car and the phone-app. Would I rather drive the Tesla or the Taycan, the Taycan wind hands down. When I drove my Model S to sell it, after driving my Taycan home from the dealer 3,500miles, it felt like I was driving a Caddy, the handling is just so different (and I had the Plus sport suspension on the Model S). Would I buy another Tesla (I bought 4 brand new Model S in the last decade), not with a stalkless yoke, rounded or not (main reason why I didn't get myself a MS Plaid while waiting for the Taycan). Would I buy another Porsche, so far yes.

Take what you want from the above. A decade of driving Tesla Model S'es, happy with the Taycan so far (a month and half), even though I do need to take it in for door handle issues (which seem to happen when temperatures drop below freezing, so not lately). All 4 Model S'es I bought required service TLC after production, so Taycan needing the same is not a deal breaker for me. In this case, will have to wait till next winter so I can repro the issue.

 

[f1eng]

Both cars run on electricity. That's the only thing they have in common. Why are people comparing them?

Really?
They are also both 4 door saloon cars with a good turn of speed.
There is a big difference in price but not everybody has price as their principle choice parameter (I never have).
The reason I didn’t consider the M3 for long was the plastic seat interior and touch controls. A poor choice of exterior colour was another bad side.

 

[f1eng]

while the overused mantra "smooth is fast" is utter bullshit

It isn’t bullshit in Formula 1 racing and never has been.

Smooth is both faster and more consistent and was the whole time I was involved (1975 to 2009) whatever rules we had.

Any driver who wasn’t smooth was inconsistent and f*cked his tyres, mind you few drivers like that got as far as F1 and weren’t in it long if they did!