Tesla Cybertruck’s 911 Gimmick

[whitex]

If that’s what’s important why not drive a Plaid? Cheaper, faster, and quicker 0-60. Bigger interior.
Same goes for a C8 Z06 vs GT3, Corvette wins again using those same metrics.
I would purchase neither because that’s nots what is important.

I am not arguing what is important, nor what should be important. I am simply making an observation that the 3 parameters which Porsche marketing is heavily emphasizing to differentiate between Taycan trims are 0-60 times with Launch Control, Launch Control max horsepower, and top track speed. Your response perfectly illustrates my point that Porsche will have to change their marketing message and de-emphasize what they are currently pushing, focus on a completely different set of performance parameters on which they are superior, at least at or below Porsche price point.

 

[McgR]

I can understand this and sometimes think this way. However the Taycan to me is the sexiest sedan ever made and is so so capable on backroads for what it is. To me this makes it worth it.

Do I wish Porsche offered a performance boost for its existing customers for sure. At the end of the day this is not what’s going to make me switch. However if I have another battery failure it’s gone.

To me too. Don’t want to change. But I am always looking if I can improve myself. For now I can’t.

 

[Vercingetorix]

I am not arguing what is important, nor what should be important. I am simply making an observation that the 3 parameters which Porsche marketing is heavily emphasizing to differentiate between Taycan trims are 0-60 times with Launch Control, Launch Control max horsepower, and top track speed. Your response perfectly illustrates my point, Porsche will have change their marketing message and de-emphasize what they are currently pushing, focus on a completely different set of performance parameters on which they are superior, at least at or below Porsche price point.

I disagree. Their marketing works. Record sales in 2023. I think people who know what they are buying with Porsche find the marketing irrelevant anyways. They know the real numbers will always be better than what Porsche says they are.
https://newsroom.porsche.com/en_US/...Atlanta, Georgia.,previous record set in 2022.
https://www.autocarpro.in/news-inte...n-2023-cayenne-is-best-selling-product-118683

 

[whitex]

Record sales in 2023

Porsche sold less Taycans worldwide in 2023 than in 2021, so definitely not record number of Taycans sold in a year. Sure, the 2022 to 2023 increase seems impressive, but that's because 2022 sales numbers nosedived. If your boss cuts your pay by 30% for 2024, then gives you a record 41% raise in 2025, you're still making less money in 2025 than before the 30% cut, but hey, you can say "I got a record raise".

I disagree. Their marketing works.

I think people who know what they are buying with Porsche find the marketing irrelevant anyways. They know the real numbers will always be better than what Porsche says they are.

Wait, so their marketing works or is irrelevant then?

 

[Vercingetorix]

Porsche sold less Taycans in 2023 than in 2021, so definitely not record number of Taycans sold in a year. Sure, the 2022 to 2023 increase seems impressive, but that's because 2022 sales numbers nosedived. If your boss cuts your pay by 30% for 2024, then gives you a record 41% raise in 2025, you're still making less money in 2025 than before the 30% cut, but hey, you can say "I got a record raise".



Wait, so their marketing works or is irrelevant then?

It works for those that don’t know what they are wanting to buy. Those of us who have sampled the drug keep coming back. Thus marketing is working because sales are up. Porsche will always have the loyalists where the marketing doesn’t matter. I bought my Taycan doing 0 research. Name alone was all I needed.

 

[whitex]

It works for those that don’t know what they are wanting to buy. Those of us who have sampled the drug keep coming back. Thus marketing is working because sales are up. Porsche will always have the loyalists where the marketing doesn’t matter. I bought my Taycan doing 0 research. Name alone was all I needed.

I was never a brand loyalist. I always gave preference to brands which I had good prior experience with, but I also looked at current offerings from competition to pick "best of breed" products. My first Porsche was over 20 years ago, loved the car, but then had a family and moved to a state with horrible roads, so the 911 became impractical and uncomfortable to drive on poor quality roads. I considered Porsche every time I swapped cars since, but they never had the best of breed for my needs until the Taycan CT (I considered the Cayenne twice, both times it just didn't impress me - maybe Porsche marketing failed there). I drove Tesla Model S'es for a decade because they did best satisfy my needs, but after 10 years, I found a better car (Taycan CT) so I switched brands. I still think Tesla makes a good product, but for what I wanted Porsche did better (for more money too, but for me it was worth it). When the time comes to buy the next car, Porsche will most likely be in the running (unless I start experiencing horrible reliability issues with the Taycan - the heater situation is kind of worrying me right now as I like to do road trips) but I will also be looking at all other brands and their products available at the time.

 

[Vercingetorix]

Porsche sold less Taycans worldwide in 2023 than in 2021, so definitely not record number of Taycans sold in a year. Sure, the 2022 to 2023 increase seems impressive, but that's because 2022 sales numbers nosedived. If your boss cuts your pay by 30% for 2024, then gives you a record 41% raise in 2025, you're still making less money in 2025 than before the 30% cut, but hey, you can say "I got a record raise".

,+
This has nothing to do with marketing. It was a lack of cars, and the increase in q4 2023 probably means they could have sold more 2022s if they had them to sell.
‘The decline was due to supply chain bottlenecks and limited component availability. Both issues affected the electric sports car in particular”
https://insideevs.com/news/631126/porsche-taycan-global-sales-2022q4/

https://electrek.co/2023/07/26/pors...tlenecks and limited component availability.”

 

[whitex]

This has nothing to do with marketing. It was a lack of cars
‘The decline was due to supply chain bottlenecks and limited component availability. Both issues affected the electric sports car in particular”
https://insideevs.com/news/631126/porsche-taycan-global-sales-2022q4/

Even if you take away 2022, 2023 is till not a record year, even though I'm sure there was a spillover demand from 2022 (I was waiting for my Taycan since 2021, got it in 2023, so my Taycan counted to 2023 numbers even though I put down first deposit in 2021).

 

[Vercingetorix]

Even if you take away 2022, 2023 is till not a record year, even though I'm sure there was a spillover demand from 2022 (I was waiting for my Taycan since 2021, got it in 2023, so my Taycan counted to 2023 numbers even though I put down first deposit in 2021).

You think marketing would change any of this? People are waiting for the updated Taycan or the Macan EV. They will both be marketed just like the present cars, because it works.

 

[whitex]

You think marketing would change any of this? People are waiting for the updated Taycan or the Macan EV. They will both be marketed just like the present cars, because it works.

I don't know, perhaps as you say, marketing is irrelevant and Porsche made the sales despite of their marketing. All I'm saying it Porsche is marketing on numbers which they are not market leaders on. If you're going to market the top tier priced cars, you should market the top tier metrics. "You should buy out product which costs the most in the category because we are 4th best in the category" just doesn't sound like a good marketing message.

 

[f1eng]

My 4CT and even a 4S are beated by the model 3 LR. If they introduce the M3 performance it will also beat the gts.

Only in a drag race which nobody round here ever has or will do so absolutely not of any consequence to any car buyer I know.

Porsche rely on test drives to sell cars, and probably sell the expensive ones more as a status symbol than anything else.

 

[Vercingetorix]

Only in a drag race which nobody round here ever has or will do so absolutely not of any consequence to any car buyer I know.

Porsche rely on test drives to sell cars, and probably sell the expensive ones more as a status symbol than anything else.

Best test drive ever. Instructor mentioned that people think the $1300 is expensive. Him and I both agreed I probably wasted $300-$400 in tires alone. GT3 was the easy winner for me.

 

[f1eng]

GT3 was the easy winner for me.

I am pretty sure it would be for me too, but I haven’t tried. Good throttle and chassis response are the major factors for me so a high revving normally aspirated car weighing 230kg less would be hugely better than a turbo, however much better turbo installations are these days.

I am not a fan of turbo engined cars.

 

[WasserGKuehlt]

I don't know, perhaps as you say, marketing is irrelevant and Porsche made the sales despite of their marketing. All I'm saying it Porsche is marketing on numbers which they are not market leaders on. If you're going to market the top tier priced cars, you should market the top tier metrics. "You should buy out product which costs the most in the category because we are 4th best in the category" just doesn't sound like a good marketing message.

Sorry to cut in, what I think @Vercingetorix is saying is that the numbers in Porsche's marketing don't really sway opinions. They are publishing a 0-100/0-60 number because they have to (in the sense of summarizing a car in 3-4 numbers), but even the most casual of gearheads would know a) the numbers are conservative, and b) there is far more to an experience than metrics.

So when you say "best of breed", it sounds more like "best accelerating of all cars" (or whichever metric is taken into consideration).

Consequently, the vast majority of Porsche marketing material is <driving on open road with sweeping turns>. (There was that one NFL/SNF ad that focused on incentives.)

After a long string of BMWs ("Freude am Fahren"/"The Joy of Driving", The Ultimate Driving Machine, 50/50 weight distribution ), I drove a ratty NA 944 as my first Porsche experience, and it opened my eyes on what real road and steering feel is. BMW's marketing felt like a steaming pile - why hadn't anyone told me? Never looked back since, and I don't think I'll ever do that. It's not the badge - in fact, I am embarrassed that I am "driving a Porsche" in certain situations - it's the engineering and philosophy underneath.

 

[whitex]

Sorry to cut in, what I think @Vercingetorix is saying is that the numbers in Porsche's marketing don't really sway opinions. They are publishing a 0-100/0-60 number because they have to (in the sense of summarizing a car in 3-4 numbers), but even the most casual of gearheads would know a) the numbers are conservative, and b) there is far more to an experience than metrics.

If the numbers are as you say don't sway opinions, then why bother with theose numbers in marketing at all? Marketing's job is to sway opinions to sell the most expensive model they can convince the customer to buy. It sounds like the differentiating factors which might sway an opinion are starting price and included options. If they have to use metrics, why not list some metrics where Porsche shines. If there are no actual metrics, but a only a subjective "feel of the road", then market the feel of the road, though I'm not sure how that would differentiate a Taycan RWD vs. Turbos S (Turbo S heavier, so more understeer for double the money? ). Or maybe they should market track times, cornering capabilities, moose test (a slalom test, though apparently the Model S Plaid beat the Taycan in a moose test, so perhaps not that).

For me, they should focus on the driving experience, luxury features of the car, and its functionality (I like the foot garages for example as it gives rear passengers more legroom, RAS, PDCC, or the FLIR with collision detection and spotlighting the possible collision target). The non-LC power/acceleration also matters to me as I do enjoy accelerating out of the street traffic herd wherever I can, even if the herd catches up to me the next red light - I prefer to drive with room around me, not surrounded by a bunch of people spacing out or on their phones. Power is also fun on an occasional track experience (non-drag-racing).